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Discuss Toyota - invest in a winner in the alt.autos.ford forum at Car Dealer Forums; Kiplinger's Stock Watch - April 24, 2007 ...Toyota cars have fewer defects than any other ...
  1. #1
    George Orwell
    Guest

    Default Toyota - invest in a winner

    Kiplinger's Stock Watch - April 24, 2007

    ...Toyota cars have fewer defects than any other make, and Toyota has
    several other advantages that make the company a compelling investment.

    To start, rising gasoline prices are likely, and Toyota is a leader in
    hybrid technology. It opened its first U.S. hybrid car plant in
    Kentucky last year. And while Ford and GM are closing plants, Toyota
    plants here and abroad continue to operate at full capacity, points out
    a Citigroup research report. Toyota employs as many workers as GM, it
    just does so much more efficiently. In fact, the last time Toyota had a
    big layoff was the 1950s.

    Toyota is a financial juggernaut. It has been the world's most
    profitable automaker for years. When earnings slip a bit, the headlines
    aren't about layoffs and restructuring, they're about the company
    sinking more yen into research and development or quality control...
    ==========
    GM vs Toyota vs Ford, 10-year chart: http://tinyurl.com/36zcgl




    › See More: Toyota - invest in a winner

  2. #2
    Jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    "George Orwell" <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in
    message news:ff3b9515f778da4a90ee92a6cd5b13c2@mixmaster.it ...
    > Kiplinger's Stock Watch - April 24, 2007
    >
    > ..Toyota cars have fewer defects than any other make, and Toyota has
    > several other advantages that make the company a compelling investment.
    >
    > To start, rising gasoline prices are likely, and Toyota is a leader in
    > hybrid technology. It opened its first U.S. hybrid car plant in
    > Kentucky last year. And while Ford and GM are closing plants, Toyota
    > plants here and abroad continue to operate at full capacity, points out
    > a Citigroup research report. Toyota employs as many workers as GM, it
    > just does so much more efficiently. In fact, the last time Toyota had a
    > big layoff was the 1950s.
    >
    > Toyota is a financial juggernaut. It has been the world's most
    > profitable automaker for years. When earnings slip a bit, the headlines
    > aren't about layoffs and restructuring, they're about the company
    > sinking more yen into research and development or quality control...
    > ==========
    > GM vs Toyota vs Ford, 10-year chart: http://tinyurl.com/36zcgl


    GM's and Ford's earnings have not slipped a bit. They nose-dived.

    I think the bottom line is that Toyota and Honda think a lot more about the
    long-term growth of the company compared to Ford, GM and Diamler Chrysler.

    I do see more long-term thinking at the Michigan-3: I am impressed with the
    cars all three have introduced in the US in the last 2 years. And Chrysler
    is making great improvements to its minivan.

    Jeff


  3. #3
    C. E. White
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    "George Orwell" <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in
    message news:ff3b9515f778da4a90ee92a6cd5b13c2@mixmaster.it ...
    > Kiplinger's Stock Watch - April 24, 2007
    >
    > ..Toyota cars have fewer defects than any other make, and Toyota has
    > several other advantages that make the company a compelling
    > investment.


    Not entirely accurate...

    According to JD Powers the leader in initial quality is Porsche,
    followed by Lexus, Hyundai, and then Toyota.

    For long term dependability JD Power ranked Toyota fourth behind
    Lexus, Mercury, Buick, and Cadillac.

    In either case the difference between Toyota and "average" is trivial
    and probably not statistically meaningful (I can't see how 0.3
    problems per car can be significant). One study recently concluded
    that Ford and Toyota quality were in statistical dead heat.See :
    http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...TO01/704180425

    > To start, rising gasoline prices are likely, and Toyota is a leader
    > in
    > hybrid technology. It opened its first U.S. hybrid car plant in
    > Kentucky last year. And while Ford and GM are closing plants, Toyota
    > plants here and abroad continue to operate at full capacity, points
    > out
    > a Citigroup research report. Toyota employs as many workers as GM,
    > it
    > just does so much more efficiently. In fact, the last time Toyota
    > had a
    > big layoff was the 1950s.


    If it employees as many workers as GM, yet, at least until now, sold
    fewer cars, how can they do "so much more efficiently?" The statement
    seems wrong, although the sentiment might be right.

    And although Toyota might be doing well in the US and Europe, in its
    home market, it sales are down more than 10%. In contrast, outside of
    it's home market (the US), Ford is doing well, but it sales are down
    13% in the US. So when the press talks about Ford, they always
    emphasize the US problems. Why is it when the press talks about Toyota
    they skip over it's home market problems and emphasize the US results?

    > Toyota is a financial juggernaut. It has been the world's most
    > profitable automaker for years. When earnings slip a bit, the
    > headlines
    > aren't about layoffs and restructuring, they're about the company
    > sinking more yen into research and development or quality control...


    So why then has Toyota had major quality problems in recent years? In
    2005 Toyota recalled more cars than GM or Ford. Why does the US press
    rarely mention this?

    Here are some other references regarding Toyota quality:

    http://tinyurl.com/32yxcq
    http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/...ess/recall.php
    http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/09/...ss/quality.php
    http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...024/LATESTNEWS


    > ==========
    > GM vs Toyota vs Ford, 10-year chart: http://tinyurl.com/36zcgl


    For an example of how irrelevant this is, see
    http://tinyurl.com/2ec6jn

    Personally, I'd recommend against investing in any automobile company.
    But I suppose if I wanted to invest in the segment, I'd go for the
    undervalued company - and I can't see how that is Toyota. The long
    term trend has for Toyota to track lower than the major averages. With
    the recent run-up in the price, it has greatly out performed the
    averages. I would expect the price to drop back to the historical
    trends in the longer run, making an investment in Toyota risky. This
    has nothing to do with the quality of the cars, so no matter how good
    the cars are, I don't think the stick is a good bet. But that is just
    my opinion.

    Ed



  4. #4
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
    news:YMqZh.5436$Hd1.3391@trndny07...

    > I think the bottom line is that Toyota and Honda think a lot more about

    the
    > long-term growth of the company compared to Ford, GM and Diamler Chrysler.


    We had to come up against them in the specialty chemicals business, and they
    were formidable. Apparently the Japanese have (or had) strong support from
    the
    financial sector to allow them to spend time and money in development and
    market control. (I suspect the Japanese worker is the one who makes the
    sacrifices in terms of taxes,etc, and the industries stand to gain from this
    strong position)

    Never think, however, that they are not innovators nor that their technical
    sector is not equal to ours. Our children seem to be suffering from
    laziness
    and underachievement, while theirs still work hard to learn and achieve.

    This is not a short term challenge for the USA. We have a problem, and it
    is us.



  5. #5
    Jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    <HLS@nospam.nix> wrote in message
    news:b%qZh.6531$2v1.4847@newssvr14.news.prodigy.ne t...
    >
    > "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
    > news:YMqZh.5436$Hd1.3391@trndny07...
    >
    >> I think the bottom line is that Toyota and Honda think a lot more about

    > the
    >> long-term growth of the company compared to Ford, GM and Diamler
    >> Chrysler.

    >
    > We had to come up against them in the specialty chemicals business, and
    > they
    > were formidable. Apparently the Japanese have (or had) strong support
    > from
    > the
    > financial sector to allow them to spend time and money in development and
    > market control. (I suspect the Japanese worker is the one who makes the
    > sacrifices in terms of taxes,etc, and the industries stand to gain from
    > this
    > strong position)


    Absolutely true.

    Unfortunately, Wall Street is too often driven by next quarter's results.
    The results 5 years from now is more important.

    > Never think, however, that they are not innovators nor that their
    > technical
    > sector is not equal to ours. Our children seem to be suffering from
    > laziness
    > and underachievement, while theirs still work hard to learn and achieve.


    It is very sad when you see American kids who gifts are wasted. I see it
    every day in NYC, where there is not nearly a strong enough culture of
    learning. This same culture is in every American city. Fortunately, there
    people who are able to give these kids a real chance, like those who sponsor
    I Have a Dream programs and Harlem RBI.

    Sadly, some inner city youth are more likely to spend time in jail than they
    are to go to college. What a waste.

    > This is not a short term challenge for the USA. We have a problem, and it
    > is us.


    We also have a solution: It is us.

    As they say, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the
    problem.

    Jeff


  6. #6
    DH
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner

    > C. E. White" <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
    > news:46363a69$1@kcnews01...
    >
    > "George Orwell" <Use-Author-Supplied-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in
    > message news:ff3b9515f778da4a90ee92a6cd5b13c2@mixmaster.it ...
    >> Kiplinger's Stock Watch - April 24, 2007
    >>
    >> ..Toyota cars have fewer defects than any other make, and Toyota has
    >> several other advantages that make the company a compelling investment.

    >
    > Not entirely accurate...
    >
    > According to JD Powers the leader in initial quality is Porsche, followed
    > by Lexus, Hyundai, and then Toyota.
    >
    > For long term dependability JD Power ranked Toyota fourth behind Lexus,
    > Mercury, Buick, and Cadillac.


    What's their long-term survey, now? Three years, isn't it? My "new" car is
    a 2001.

    > In either case the difference between Toyota and "average" is trivial and
    > probably not statistically meaningful (I can't see how 0.3 problems per
    > car can be significant). One study recently concluded that Ford and Toyota
    > quality were in statistical dead heat.See :
    > http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...TO01/704180425


    Whatever difference there is seems to make a huge difference to the
    manufacturer. It's probably not precisely an apples-to-apples comparison
    and it's a little old but this article on warranty casts an interesting
    light on vehicle reliability...

    http://www.warrantyweek.com/archive/ww20060620.html

    This essentially cuts the gross profit on each GM and Ford by 1.3% relative
    to Toyota and Honda.

    >> To start, rising gasoline prices are likely, and Toyota is a leader in
    >> hybrid technology. It opened its first U.S. hybrid car plant in
    >> Kentucky last year. And while Ford and GM are closing plants, Toyota
    >> plants here and abroad continue to operate at full capacity, points out
    >> a Citigroup research report. Toyota employs as many workers as GM, it
    >> just does so much more efficiently. In fact, the last time Toyota had a
    >> big layoff was the 1950s.

    >
    > If it employees as many workers as GM, yet, at least until now, sold fewer
    > cars, how can they do "so much more efficiently?" The statement seems
    > wrong, although the sentiment might be right.
    >
    > And although Toyota might be doing well in the US and Europe, in its home
    > market, it sales are down more than 10%. In contrast, outside of it's home
    > market (the US), Ford is doing well, but it sales are down 13% in the US.
    > So when the press talks about Ford, they always emphasize the US problems.
    > Why is it when the press talks about Toyota they skip over it's home
    > market problems and emphasize the US results?
    >
    >> Toyota is a financial juggernaut. It has been the world's most
    >> profitable automaker for years. When earnings slip a bit, the headlines
    >> aren't about layoffs and restructuring, they're about the company
    >> sinking more yen into research and development or quality control...

    >
    > So why then has Toyota had major quality problems in recent years? In 2005
    > Toyota recalled more cars than GM or Ford. Why does the US press rarely
    > mention this?
    >
    > Here are some other references regarding Toyota quality:
    >
    > http://tinyurl.com/32yxcq
    > http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/...ess/recall.php
    > http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/09/...ss/quality.php
    > http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...024/LATESTNEWS
    >
    >
    >> ==========
    >> GM vs Toyota vs Ford, 10-year chart: http://tinyurl.com/36zcgl

    >
    > For an example of how irrelevant this is, see http://tinyurl.com/2ec6jn
    >
    > Personally, I'd recommend against investing in any automobile company. But
    > I suppose if I wanted to invest in the segment, I'd go for the undervalued
    > company - and I can't see how that is Toyota. The long term trend has for
    > Toyota to track lower than the major averages. With the recent run-up in
    > the price, it has greatly out performed the averages. I would expect the
    > price to drop back to the historical trends in the longer run, making an
    > investment in Toyota risky. This has nothing to do with the quality of the
    > cars, so no matter how good the cars are, I don't think the stick is a
    > good bet. But that is just my opinion.
    >
    > Ed




    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com


  7. #7
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
    news:vfrZh.3390$%f7.2194@trndny03...

    >
    > We also have a solution: It is us.
    >
    > As they say, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the
    > problem.
    >
    > Jeff


    Absolutely, Jeff. I saw an interview with Bill Bradley this morning, and
    his attitude is
    so very positive. He said, basically, that we dont need 'leadership'. We
    need to organize
    ourselves strongly and TELL our elected servants what to do. We certainly
    cant expect
    much from them, historically.

    The American people are good and strong. But we have to get our of our
    LazyBoy chairs
    and get our business in order.

    If we cannot or WILL NOT enforce our borders and immigration rules, what
    sort of worthless
    people have we sent to Washington. We need a Million Gringo march, or
    something.



  8. #8
    Jeff
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    <HLS@nospam.nix> wrote in message
    news:JouZh.5166$H84.2500@newssvr22.news.prodigy.ne t...
    >
    > "Jeff" <news@googlemail.com> wrote in message
    > news:vfrZh.3390$%f7.2194@trndny03...
    >
    >>
    >> We also have a solution: It is us.
    >>
    >> As they say, if you are not part of the solution, you are part of the
    >> problem.
    >>
    >> Jeff

    >
    > Absolutely, Jeff. I saw an interview with Bill Bradley this morning, and
    > his attitude is
    > so very positive. He said, basically, that we dont need 'leadership'. We
    > need to organize
    > ourselves strongly and TELL our elected servants what to do. We
    > certainly
    > cant expect
    > much from them, historically.
    >
    > The American people are good and strong. But we have to get our of our
    > LazyBoy chairs
    > and get our business in order.
    >
    > If we cannot or WILL NOT enforce our borders and immigration rules, what
    > sort of worthless
    > people have we sent to Washington. We need a Million Gringo march, or
    > something.


    Yes, certainly. My great-great-grandparents came from Germany and
    Switzerland. When they came here, they came with a great work ethic. My
    great grandfather worked in the mines in Scranton. My grandfather that coal
    around on the back of a Ford Model A pickup truck in the winter and ice
    around in the summer.

    We certainly should march all these Gringos. Strait to the schools and the
    libraries, with all the people in the US. What this country needs is
    brainpower. Our inner-city kids, our country kids, our suburban kids,
    whether they are citizens or not are our main resources. We need to work
    together to make this a better country.

    Jeff


  9. #9
    badgolferman
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner

    George Orwell, 4/30/2007,1:45:07 PM, wrote:

    > Toyota is a financial juggernaut. It has been the world's most
    > profitable automaker for years.


    I am excited to report my TM stock has increased 50% January 2005. I
    only wish I had bought more but I can't complain about my CVX stock
    that has increased the same amount since I bought it three days
    afterwards.

    --
    "Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief
    in freedom itself." ~ Milton Friedman

  10. #10
    C. E. White
    Guest

    Default Re: Toyota - invest in a winner


    "badgolferman" <REMOVETHISbadgolferman@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:xn0f5kzjg4ay62o002@news.readfreenews.net...
    > George Orwell, 4/30/2007,1:45:07 PM, wrote:
    >
    >> Toyota is a financial juggernaut. It has been the world's most
    >> profitable automaker for years.

    >
    > I am excited to report my TM stock has increased 50% January 2005.
    > I
    > only wish I had bought more but I can't complain about my CVX stock
    > that has increased the same amount since I bought it three days
    > afterwards.


    What do you actually get when you purchase Toyota Stock? I assume you
    are actually buying American Depositary Receipts for Toyota Motor
    Stock. What bank holds the actual shares? Do they keep a portion of
    the dividends or sales price to cover their expenses?

    Personally I'd be nervous holding onto a stock trading at 2 to 2.5
    times it historical average.

    Ed



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