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Discuss DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system in the alt.autos.gm forum at Car Dealer Forums; All, Is there a way to build/connect the following items to an AC system and ...
  1. #1
    BoBo
    Guest

    Default DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

    All,

    Is there a way to build/connect the following items to an AC system
    and have it evacuate all of the refrigerant.

    1. Manifold gauge set
    2. 2cfm 2-stage vacuum pump 110v
    3. emty propane tank.

    My understangin is that the commercial units costing $4,000
    essentially are built fromthe same components.
    I have no plans to reuse the old 134a. All I want to do is
    depressurize the system so that I can replace a bad compressor.



    › See More: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

  2. #2
    Sharon Cooke
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system



    BoBo wrote:
    > All,
    >
    > Is there a way to build/connect the following items to an AC system
    > and have it evacuate all of the refrigerant.
    >
    > 1. Manifold gauge set
    > 2. 2cfm 2-stage vacuum pump 110v
    > 3. emty propane tank.
    >
    > My understangin is that the commercial units costing $4,000
    > essentially are built fromthe same components.
    > I have no plans to reuse the old 134a. All I want to do is
    > depressurize the system so that I can replace a bad compressor.


    If the compressor's shot, there probably isn't that much refrigerant
    left in the system to worry about.

  3. #3
    BoBo
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

    On Wed, 16 May 2007 23:58:01 -0400, Tim J. <tj66821@usa.not> wrote:

    >On Wed, 16 May 2007 20:19:11 -0400, BoBo <bobo@nowhere.com> wrote:
    >
    >>All,
    >>
    >>Is there a way to build/connect the following items to an AC system
    >>and have it evacuate all of the refrigerant.
    >>
    >>1. Manifold gauge set
    >>2. 2cfm 2-stage vacuum pump 110v
    >>3. emty propane tank.
    >>
    >>My understangin is that the commercial units costing $4,000
    >>essentially are built fromthe same components.
    >>I have no plans to reuse the old 134a. All I want to do is
    >>depressurize the system so that I can replace a bad compressor.

    >
    >Sounds like it would be cheaper (and easier) to purchase a compressor,
    >and take it to a certified shop to have it replaced and your system
    >vacuumed and recharged. I had a Ford done recently for $120.



    I have the manifold gauge. I bought it on Ebay for $25
    I'll cost $30 to rent the pump for the weekend.
    The propane tank was free.
    2 cans of R-134a is about $12
    I can purchase a brand new GM HT6 compressor for $220

    Total: $287


    I've called some ac shops and dealers and they want between $600 -
    $1100 to do the job






  4. #4
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system


    "BoBo" <bobo@nowhere.com> wrote in message
    news:2s8o431osm54vbe20mjp0f93sue7io3rl1@4ax.com...

    > I have the manifold gauge. I bought it on Ebay for $25
    > I'll cost $30 to rent the pump for the weekend.
    > The propane tank was free.
    > 2 cans of R-134a is about $12
    > I can purchase a brand new GM HT6 compressor for $220
    >
    > Total: $287
    >
    >
    > I've called some ac shops and dealers and they want between $600 -
    > $1100 to do the job



    If you have any refrigerant left, you can pump it out of the system into
    an approved tank (but I am not sure the propane tank would fit that
    requirement). You can even chill the tank with something like dry ice
    to make the job easier. What do you intend to do with it then??

    GM compressors often fail at the front seal and the refrigerant is mostly
    lost anyway. Do you know if yours has a significant charge?

    The sealed system may have a lot of contamination in it. Do you intend
    to flush it and replace the expansion device (orifice tube or expansion
    valve)?

    I have to do this job soon on my van to replace the evaporator core.
    I might have a little refrigerant pressure left, but have no intention
    to try to recoup the couple of grams of refrigerant. It will be just
    traces.



  5. #5
    putt@webtv.net
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

    >All I want to do is depressurize the
    > system so that I can replace a bad
    > compressor.


    It does take some expertize to do the job right/safely. Not knowing
    what the gauges are 'telling' you can lead to a dangerous situation and
    damage the ac system. None of it is rocket-surgery though and is easy
    enough to learn.

    As to evacuating the system: I'd suspect that was done already by the
    compressor when it gave up. The gauges will tell you that. A vacuum
    pump might be a good investment in the 'long run'

    Those evacuating systems not only capture the refrigerant but also
    clean/recycle it for reuse.

    Dave S(Texas)


  6. #6
    Steve W.
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

    BoBo wrote:
    > On Wed, 16 May 2007 23:58:01 -0400, Tim J. <tj66821@usa.not> wrote:
    >
    >> On Wed, 16 May 2007 20:19:11 -0400, BoBo <bobo@nowhere.com> wrote:
    >>
    >>> All,
    >>>
    >>> Is there a way to build/connect the following items to an AC system
    >>> and have it evacuate all of the refrigerant.
    >>>
    >>> 1. Manifold gauge set
    >>> 2. 2cfm 2-stage vacuum pump 110v
    >>> 3. emty propane tank.
    >>>
    >>> My understangin is that the commercial units costing $4,000
    >>> essentially are built fromthe same components.
    >>> I have no plans to reuse the old 134a. All I want to do is
    >>> depressurize the system so that I can replace a bad compressor.

    >> Sounds like it would be cheaper (and easier) to purchase a compressor,
    >> and take it to a certified shop to have it replaced and your system
    >> vacuumed and recharged. I had a Ford done recently for $120.

    >
    >
    > I have the manifold gauge. I bought it on Ebay for $25
    > I'll cost $30 to rent the pump for the weekend.
    > The propane tank was free.
    > 2 cans of R-134a is about $12
    > I can purchase a brand new GM HT6 compressor for $220
    >
    > Total: $287
    >
    >
    > I've called some ac shops and dealers and they want between $600 -
    > $1100 to do the job
    >


    That is because compressor failure usually means you have a LOT more to
    do than just replace the compressor.

    To start with you need to evacuate the system.
    Then pull the compressor and the lines to the condenser to see how much
    crud from the failed compressor made it into the condenser.
    Then you need to flush the condenser (IF it can be flushed,some cannot)
    Then you replace the accumulator/drier because of the crud from the
    compressor and the orifice tube is probably plugged as well. That gets
    you back around to the evaporator which will need to be flushed at
    least. Now that the system has been flushed and the plugged parts are
    replaced you can reassemble the system (add the proper amount of oil to
    the compressor & add an inline filter just in case you missed some crud)
    and vacuum it down and see if it holds. Then recharge the system.

    THAT is what the AC shops will do. If you JUST replace the compressor on
    a failed system you may as well take the money your spending on the
    parts and tool rental and burn it. Why? Very simply the new compressor
    WILL suck in debris from the failed unit which will destroy it in short
    order.


    --
    Steve W.
    Near Cooperstown, New York

  7. #7
    BoBo
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

    On Thu, 17 May 2007 18:49:13 -0400, "Steve W." <yahoo@yahoo.com>
    wrote:


    >
    >That is because compressor failure usually means you have a LOT more to
    >do than just replace the compressor.
    >
    >To start with you need to evacuate the system.
    >Then pull the compressor and the lines to the condenser to see how much
    >crud from the failed compressor made it into the condenser.
    >Then you need to flush the condenser (IF it can be flushed,some cannot)
    >Then you replace the accumulator/drier because of the crud from the
    >compressor and the orifice tube is probably plugged as well. That gets
    >you back around to the evaporator which will need to be flushed at
    >least. Now that the system has been flushed and the plugged parts are
    >replaced you can reassemble the system (add the proper amount of oil to
    >the compressor & add an inline filter just in case you missed some crud)
    >and vacuum it down and see if it holds. Then recharge the system.
    >
    >THAT is what the AC shops will do. If you JUST replace the compressor on
    >a failed system you may as well take the money your spending on the
    >parts and tool rental and burn it. Why? Very simply the new compressor
    >WILL suck in debris from the failed unit which will destroy it in short
    >order.



    The compressor didn't have a massive failure. Only the seals are
    leaking. Nevertheless, I will blow out the system wth compressed air
    before recharging, replace the orafice tube and accumulator.

  8. #8
    BoBo
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system

    On Thu, 17 May 2007 08:26:53 -0500, putt@webtv.net wrote:

    >>All I want to do is depressurize the
    >> system so that I can replace a bad
    >> compressor.

    >
    >It does take some expertize to do the job right/safely. Not knowing
    >what the gauges are 'telling' you can lead to a dangerous situation and
    >damage the ac system. None of it is rocket-surgery though and is easy
    >enough to learn.
    >
    >As to evacuating the system: I'd suspect that was done already by the
    >compressor when it gave up. The gauges will tell you that. A vacuum
    >pump might be a good investment in the 'long run'
    >
    >Those evacuating systems not only capture the refrigerant but also
    >clean/recycle it for reuse.
    >
    >Dave S(Texas)


    I have the factory service manual for the truck that explains in
    detail how to diagnose and repair the ac system. As long as I keep an
    eye on the gauges and I don't open the high side while recharging,
    it's pretty safe and starightforward procedure.

    The manifold is in the process of being shipped so I don't know what
    the pressures are. Assuming both high/low sides read zero, what is the
    possibility of liquid refrigerant still remaining? If there is a leak,
    will all of the liquid refrigerant boil off in a matter of a few
    seconds once the atmosphere enters the system?

  9. #9
    Guest

    Default Re: DIY'er needs method to evacuate 134a from ac system


    "BoBo" <bobo@nowhere.com> wrote in message
    news:300r43hihjsl4nvtnf5hahpnkltd975pt4@4ax.com...

    > The compressor didn't have a massive failure. Only the seals are
    > leaking. Nevertheless, I will blow out the system wth compressed air
    > before recharging, replace the orafice tube and accumulator.


    As I suggested in my previous post, and in total agreement with Steve W.,
    you may well need to flush the system even if you have not had a major
    failure.

    I just did my Reatta and upgraded it to R134a. It did not have a major
    failure, just an R12 leak at the front seal. It was not even a big leak.

    We did the job correctly. We replaced the compressor AFTER removing
    the expansion device and filter/drier and flushing. It was full of black
    corruption.

    There is a right way and a wrong way. You may get away with doing a
    halfway job....for a while.

    Even doing it the right way should not cost $1100.



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