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Discuss Should I repaint my car? in the alt.autos.nissan forum at Car Dealer Forums; I have a 1999.5 Pathfinder SE Limited Edition and engine runs well and I have ...
  1. #1
    MiamiCuse
    Guest

    Default Should I repaint my car?

    I have a 1999.5 Pathfinder SE Limited Edition and engine runs well and I
    have been keeping my with regular scheduled maintaince.

    It has 107,000 miles on it and I recently changed it's timing belt (at
    105,000). I spoke to the mechanic that does my maintainance he said I can
    get another 100,000 miles out of it easy the older models last forever.

    Does it mean the newer PF are inferior in quality?

    The problem with my car now is the paint. Being in south Florida under the
    blazing sun for many years the clear coat has partially disintegrated and so
    now it has white patches all over, I don't see any corrosion. Checked
    kbb.com and it values the car at 3500-5000 ball park.

    Trying to decide if it's worth it to repaint the car now (have not gotten a
    quote yet but I suspect around $2000 plus may be a week of car rental while
    I wait for it to be done at say $50 a day).

    Or just live with the paint problem and drive the car for as long as I can?
    The paint problem will get worse and worse until it becomes unbearable I
    think. What if I repaint it and then the transmission breaks!

    The paint problem is on the hood and on the roof, but I don't think a
    partial paint is practical if more than 30% of the surface needs to be
    painted.

    Opinions?

    MC



  2. #2
    R J Talley
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?

    If you like the car and it runs well, repaint. You would loose $1500 in
    depreciation the minute you drive a new car off the lot anyway and if your
    state has sales tax, that's another cost you must deduct from any car
    purchase, new or old. So, if you like the car but hate the paint, you would
    be money ahead to repaint and keep it.

    --
    R J Talley
    Teacher/James Madison Fellow
    "What? Me Worry? Alfred E Newman



  3. #3
    still just me
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?

    On Wed, 9 Jan 2008 05:25:02 -0800, "R J Talley" <omgb@ca.rr.com>
    wrote:

    >If you like the car and it runs well, repaint. You would loose $1500 in
    >depreciation the minute you drive a new car off the lot anyway and if your
    >state has sales tax, that's another cost you must deduct from any car
    >purchase, new or old. So, if you like the car but hate the paint, you would
    >be money ahead to repaint and keep it.



    You'll never get the money back out of the paint job. But, if you like
    it want it to look nice while you drive it, maybe it's worth it to
    you. Painting that car and driving it a few more years is much cheaper
    than replacing the car no matter how you figure it.

    If you do decide to paint it, return here for more tips on finding a
    quality paint shop. Half the job is below the surface and you need to
    find a shop that does both halves right.

  4. #4
    Jack
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?


    "MiamiCuse" <nmbexcuse@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:KJydnVGUGo-m6BnanZ2dnUVZ_j2dnZ2d@dsli.com...
    >I have a 1999.5 Pathfinder SE Limited Edition and engine runs well and I
    >have been keeping my with regular scheduled maintaince.
    >

    If its paid for...keep it...thats the best deal financially..unless you
    really want new. I have a 97 PF...and ya know waht ?? Buying a new
    vehicle, will get you a new vehicle..but not a better one. I just painted
    mine and changed both front fenders. I've got 120k miles on mine..and the
    way its running..should be good for 50 - 75 k more.

    But if you're horny for a new vehicle..go for it..




  5. #5
    DemoDisk
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?


    "still just me" <wheeledBobNOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:hdiao3595cbhiemsp3d79k436f6shqggno@4ax.com...
    > On Wed, 9 Jan 2008 05:25:02 -0800, "R J Talley" <omgb@ca.rr.com>
    > wrote:


    > If you do decide to paint it, return here for more tips on finding a
    > quality paint shop. Half the job is below the surface and you need to
    > find a shop that does both halves right.


    Hm. I've never seen advice here about paint issues, but it would be
    nice.

    I have the same problem with my old Sentra -- its pale bronze finish has
    frosted-looking patches on the trunk and hood. Some guy told me that
    will happen with a lot of metallic paints. But I can scrape it with a
    fingernail and it's bronze underneath.

    What's the truth?



  6. #6
    still just me
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?

    On Thu, 10 Jan 2008 23:28:16 -0600, "DemoDisk" <packrat@nospam.com>
    wrote:

    >Hm. I've never seen advice here about paint issues, but it would be
    >nice.
    >
    >I have the same problem with my old Sentra -- its pale bronze finish has
    >frosted-looking patches on the trunk and hood. Some guy told me that
    >will happen with a lot of metallic paints. But I can scrape it with a
    >fingernail and it's bronze underneath.
    >
    >What's the truth?


    Hard to say without seeing it - but it sounds like the clear coat has
    died. Modern metallic paints have a base layer (or two) with color and
    metallic and then a clear coat on top to protect the lower layers. If
    the clear goes bad, you will get the effect you mentioned.

    Unfortunately there's rarely any fix other than repainting. You can
    try polishing with a suitable compound but if it's at the point where
    it comes off with a fingernail, it's probably hosed.


  7. #7
    Jim Yanik
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?

    still just me <wheeledBobNOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in
    newss6go353g2igdpr0h5242ba6g17lt05j7e@4ax.com:

    > On Thu, 10 Jan 2008 23:28:16 -0600, "DemoDisk" <packrat@nospam.com>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>Hm. I've never seen advice here about paint issues, but it would be
    >>nice.
    >>
    >>I have the same problem with my old Sentra -- its pale bronze finish has
    >>frosted-looking patches on the trunk and hood. Some guy told me that
    >>will happen with a lot of metallic paints. But I can scrape it with a
    >>fingernail and it's bronze underneath.
    >>
    >>What's the truth?

    >
    > Hard to say without seeing it - but it sounds like the clear coat has
    > died. Modern metallic paints have a base layer (or two) with color and
    > metallic and then a clear coat on top to protect the lower layers. If
    > the clear goes bad, you will get the effect you mentioned.
    >
    > Unfortunately there's rarely any fix other than repainting. You can
    > try polishing with a suitable compound but if it's at the point where
    > it comes off with a fingernail, it's probably hosed.
    >
    >


    I've had a couple of Hondas that were clearcoated,and their clearcoats both
    failed. Florida weather is rough on paint jobs.

    if his truck is still mechanically sound,it's still worth even $400 to get
    it repainted at MAACO or other similar places,rather than let it rust.
    It will make him feel better about his ride,too.

    --
    Jim Yanik
    jyanik
    at
    kua.net

  8. #8
    still just me
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?

    On 12 Jan 2008 02:31:01 GMT, Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote:

    >
    >if his truck is still mechanically sound,it's still worth even $400 to get
    >it repainted at MAACO or other similar places,rather than let it rust.
    >It will make him feel better about his ride,too.


    I'd agree... and what Maaco really slacks on is the prep work. If you
    can learn to do your own sanding and pull all the lights/trim
    yourself, their paint is not all that bad.



  9. #9
    e b
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?

    On Wed, 9 Jan 2008 02:18:19 -0500, "MiamiCuse" <nmbexcuse@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    >I have a 1999.5 Pathfinder SE Limited Edition and engine runs well and I
    >have been keeping my with regular scheduled maintaince.
    >
    >It has 107,000 miles on it and I recently changed it's timing belt (at
    >105,000). I spoke to the mechanic that does my maintainance he said I can
    >get another 100,000 miles out of it easy the older models last forever.
    >
    >Does it mean the newer PF are inferior in quality?
    >
    >The problem with my car now is the paint. Being in south Florida under the
    >blazing sun for many years the clear coat has partially disintegrated and so
    >now it has white patches all over, I don't see any corrosion. Checked
    >kbb.com and it values the car at 3500-5000 ball park.
    >
    >Trying to decide if it's worth it to repaint the car now (have not gotten a
    >quote yet but I suspect around $2000 plus may be a week of car rental while
    >I wait for it to be done at say $50 a day).
    >
    >Or just live with the paint problem and drive the car for as long as I can?
    >The paint problem will get worse and worse until it becomes unbearable I
    >think. What if I repaint it and then the transmission breaks!
    >
    >The paint problem is on the hood and on the roof, but I don't think a
    >partial paint is practical if more than 30% of the surface needs to be
    >painted.
    >
    >Opinions?
    >
    >MC
    >

    This decision always turns on $ and love of the car. This condition,
    called clear coat failure occurs in all areas of the world, not just
    Florida. It is caused by not enough sun-block in the clear
    coat(really!). The paint is plastic and is destroyed in microscopic
    parts by UV- light-- heat also accelerates the condition. The top
    layer of paint, the clear coat, has failed and is loosing its grip on
    the layer of paint below it. What you can not see without
    magnification are very very small cracks that lead through the paint
    down to the metal. That is the path that water takes so it can cause
    RUST. Car manufacturers place the coatings on their cars in a system.
    Coat one is a "magnetically" placed primer applied after the car body
    is acid etched to clean the metal, then rinsed and dried. The body
    is dipped in this "EDP," then baked. The base coat is applied
    next--under a microscope the dry base coat material looks like a
    sponge, has holes, is NOT A WATER BARRIER, and is designed to stick to
    the EDP (Technical term is "electro-deposition primer"). The color
    coat is usually .002-.004" thick. This is two to four thousandths of
    an inch. Clear is applied after a flash period--time to allow the
    solvent to partially evaporate, or it is applied wet on
    wet--immediately after the base coat. The layer of clear, a
    polyurethane material, is two thousandths of an inch. Not Much
    there, and for a reason. Then the car is heated to 300 degrees to
    evaporate the water borne paint. The CLEAR COAT is the WATER BARRIER.
    This is the "system" that most factories use, and most auto body
    repair facilities (body/paint shops} try to copy. This system has
    proven to be the least harmful for the environment according to the
    EPA. This type of paint was first used in Los Angeles, CA. Paint
    applied thicker than six to eight thousandths of an inch will tend to
    crack. Lacquer (the repair paint in your father's days) required two
    to three gallons of paint. Most of which was sanded smooth and
    polished off to get a mirror like finish. Today if you try to polish
    the paint on a modern vehicle, you have just two thousandths of an
    inch....... So that white cloudy looking ring around the top of the
    car and the hood, and/or the trunk lid (boot cover-in England), is the
    edge of the failure moving towards the paint that has not completely
    failed...yet. Polishing lightly with a polishing compound that feels
    as smooth as cornstarch will not help this problem, sorry. Trying to
    use rubbing compound or polishing other than lightly, will give you
    circles of dull color surrounded by shiny clear. What you have done
    is worn a hole in the clear, and removed the protection that the paint
    offers. Look at the texture of a few cars on the showroom floor and
    you will see that mirror smooth finish is reserved only for AUTO SHOW
    CUSTOM CARS. I can not imagine leaving "orange peel" on my 59
    Corvette. But, to help answer you question, "Should I paint?," The
    answer is probably yes. As long as the motor runs, the car starts,
    does not stop when it shouldn't, the radio plays, why spend money on a
    new car during a recession not caused by you. Now that you have
    decided to invest in the longevity of your Nissan--my "Nissan" is a
    Datsun 1970 Fairlady convertible w\both hard and soft tops, repainted
    ten years ago with single stage (no clear coat} Dupont Cronar
    polyurethane based paint--the next question is do you want to work to
    get the best result? Do you want to do the important steps that will
    insure that the paint-job that you get is the best possible for the
    conditions? It has been my experience that production shops, Maaico,
    Miracle Auto Painting, 1 day Paint-A-Car, etc are wanting in two
    areas. These are insufficient sanding close to moldings and lamps,
    which is needed for mechanical adhesion of the top coats==the place
    where paint chips and peels first, and closely masking or part
    removal. You get what you PAY FOR. If you want a pristine
    paint-job, then remove every part on the vehicle before painting. I
    suggest that a paint shop would charge you prox three to six thousand
    for this little item. Here in San Francisco, at $85-130 per hour,
    that three tenths of an hour to remove and replace the tail light is
    about forty dollars. PERHAPS IF WE ACCEPT masking closely --applying
    tape to cover any moldings and lights or items attached to the outside
    of the body so the tape is very close to the painted surface of the
    car---but not touching--we can be happy with the end result and the
    price. If you decide to invest your labor to increase the quality,
    you will wet sand the vehicle with 600-1000 grit sand paper. Buy
    automotive grade primer in a spray can, acid etching primer is best,
    from a body shop supplier, and prime any bare metal spots that you
    leave--before the sun goes down. RUST IS THE BAD GUY THAT YOU ARE
    REALLY TRYING TO FOIL. The girls or guys, whatever your choice, will
    ride in a spot primed car, believe me, but a rusty car is not really
    acceptable. Especially if you have left moisture on the metal
    overnight to start microscopic rusting that will remain under the
    primer, under the new paint, to start rust spots only months after
    painting. These spots will look like small blisters that will, of
    course, grow larger. So wet sand to remove the failed clear, promote
    adhesion of the new paint, and give the quickest prep time without
    mechanical sanders, then dry the surface well before you prime.
    Electric sanders and water don't mix too well, if you decide to go
    mechanical. Use a grade coarser sandpaper for mechanical sanding, and
    use an "orbital" sander. This type of sanding device will leave
    circular scratches that are harder to see than straight line sanders.
    Use sanding grit that is specified by the paint MANUFACTURER. As
    paint ages it will shrink, and those scratches that barely show up in
    primer and not at all in fresh paint, really stand out in aged shiny
    paint. Now is the time to mention a selling point for paint shops.
    Baking the paint. Non-manufacturer paint shops will always advertise
    "Oven Baked Paint will last longer." Actually, remember that Chevy
    or Ford, or Nissan will raise the temperature to 300 degrees to
    evaporate the water out of their paint, which you remember was
    "waterborne." The instrument panel, the seat covers, the tail lamps,
    the headlamp assemblies, the--aw heck, darn near every thing in or on
    that car is plastic. Heat plastic, almost any type of plastic except
    thermosetting plastic like old Corvettes, to 200 degrees and you can
    start welding the pieces together. What your paint shop is doing with
    those heat lamps is "setting" the clear coat, by removing some of the
    solvent from the paint, and not above 125 degrees. This allows the
    shop to remove the vehicle from the protected dust free paint area
    quickly enough to place the next vehicle in the booth in order to keep
    the line moving, not to mention the bank account up. But the curing
    of the paint takes longer and is a CHEMICAL process that "cross-links"
    the molecules of the paint.
    Incidentally, the agent used to cause the "cross-linking" is an
    isocyanate based material. You have heard of that stuff before,
    usually when San Quentin State Prison reduced the inmate population
    by one--the hard way! While we are here at the point of removing the
    "repainted" car out of the paint booth, THIS IS A GOOD TIME TO MENTION
    THAT Dupont does not recommend a hard paste wax on any of their
    paint-shop products. BECAUSE paste wax products work so well to
    create a hard shell that they seal in solvents. Sealing in solvents
    stops curing of the finish, and creates cracking. Think Mud. Do you
    remember seeing a photo of a dry lake or river bed. Nice thick clay
    on top. Water mixed with the clay. The sun evaporates the water on
    top quickly leaving a flat smooth surface. But the water underneath
    dries slower, and must come out. When the water does come out, the
    clay parts and splits leaving those characteristic cracks that you
    will now look for in the National Geographic Magazines about Africa,
    The Nile, The Mississippi, and well, you get the idea. First, you
    should not need any wax at all to protect the color. That is the job
    of the clear coat. But for those of you that must, use only liquid
    car waxes such as Dupont #7, or Meguairs liquid, or Mothers in liquid
    form, or equivalent Apply wax only when you can see water not
    "beading-up" from the last wax application. Apply waxes in the shade,
    of course, with a Karate Kid "Wax on-Wax-off" technique. Because
    vehicle makers are aware today that RUST is the BAD GUY, and apply a
    wax based material inside the door panels, USING LIQUID WAX IN THE
    WASH WATER is not really necessary any more. But then, wherever the
    salt meets the road, it meets the inside of the door panels, and
    causes rust. So when you wash the new paint job, put a small amount
    of liquid wax in the wash water. The water will travel down the
    inside of the door panel past the door glass and will deposit SMALL
    AMOUNTS OF WAX.That is where rusting starts that really makes your day
    go bad. In heavy dust areas, like the dirt roads near Ada, Oklahoma,
    check the drain holes in the bottom of the door assemblies. It is OK
    for water to go in--if it drains out. NOW LETS CHECK THE HIGH
    POINTS FOR CAR PAINTING SUCCESS. 1. Check with your paint shop
    before you do anything. AHH, I forget choosing the paint shop. Well,
    you have a phone book, and a price guide called a wallet. Any shop
    that displays an "ICCAR" or "ICAR"--Inter Industry Conference on Auto
    sion Repair--will have participated in professional training for their
    technicians. This does not guarantee that they are any better than a
    non-ICAR shop, but it does mean that they are aware of proper repair
    methods when a car is crashed. Back to our list: 1. check with your
    paint shop. If the following apply's; ask if they will work with you
    doing the sanding and masking. They probably will not adjust their
    price if you do, but you will know that the paint will not come off in
    big sheets causing ugliness, repainting again, and usually days in
    court. 2.If all this is a little cloudy, check at your local library
    or car parts store for a book on auto body work and\or painting. There
    are few secrets about what is needed, the books will explain
    everything you need to know except, the amount of work that is needed.
    Should take two to five days.....Check with your local community
    college. The students there may be able to supply you with
    information, and\or paid help. IF ALL THIS SOUNDS LIKE IT IS TOO MUCH
    WORK, let your paint shop price your needs, and then get out of their
    way. Sometimes though, the cheaper paint job is the better choice.

  10. #10
    DemoDisk
    Guest

    Default Re: Should I repaint my car?


    "e b" <norcal@yahoo.com> wrote in message
    news:njtdp3pn9gd9o36lgs54v5doj1uvldq6gt@4ax.com...
    > On Wed, 9 Jan 2008 02:18:19 -0500, "MiamiCuse" <nmbexcuse@hotmail.com>
    > wrote:


    < snip>

    > >The problem with my car now is the paint. Being in south Florida

    under the
    > >blazing sun for many years the clear coat has partially disintegrated

    and so
    > >now it has white patches all over, I don't see any corrosion.

    Checked
    > >kbb.com and it values the car at 3500-5000 ball park.


    > This decision always turns on $ and love of the car. This condition,
    > called clear coat failure occurs in all areas of the world, not just
    > Florida. It is caused by not enough sun-block in the clear
    > coat(really!). The paint is plastic and is destroyed in microscopic
    > parts by UV- light-- heat also accelerates the condition. The top
    > layer of paint, the clear coat, has failed and is loosing its grip on
    > the layer of paint below it.


    <snip>

    Did your information come from an article? I check this group daily and
    this post is one of the best I've seen on any Nissan topic. You put a
    lot of work into it.

    Unfortunately for me (and others), it's bad news. I've been following
    this thread as my '93 Sentra has the same problem -- less than 55K on it
    since new, but it looks like crap even though it's mechanically sound.
    It needs TLC, but judging from your article, I doubt I could provide it,
    as the paint restoration would probably equal the car's value. And I've
    had no luck finding quality workmanship, so I'm not optimistic there.

    But your post! Hey, it's great to know what goes into today's factory
    paint jobs. Thanks.

    JPM



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