"EdV" <systmengr@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:e07bc39d-d0bf-4581-8b47-05014f425c2b@w40g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> It is no longer required to change the ATF on the 5spd A/T on the
> 2007
> Camry, at least that's what the label on the dipstick says, if the
> car
> is driven under normal conditions. WTF?
>
> Is it the same for the Sienna and Scion who uses the same 5 spd
> A/T??

This might be news for Toyotas, but it isn't different from millions
of other vehicles. My Father never had the automatic transmission
fluid changed in anything he owned, and never had a transmission fail
either except for one. I managed to kill a C4 in an old
Fairlane....this may have had something to do with running the car
into a pond (don't tell Dad) .......

The problem I see here is the wording......"under normal conditions."
Given Toyota's notoriously bad Customer Service, what are the chances
that they will blame you if your transmission prematurely fails down
the road and you can't produce notarized, signed in blood receipts
from a Toyota Dealer in Japan proving you had the transmission fluid
changed every 30K miles......

I am planning on draining the fluid from the transmission pan of my
SO's RAV4 every 30K miles and adding that much fresh fluid. I know
that won't change the fluid in the torque converter, but I figure
renewing part of the fluid regularly will be a good thing. I'll buy
the fluid at the Toyota dealer. Hopefully I can use those receipt to
fight off the Toyota Goons if the transmission fails prematurely.

Ed

On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 07:55:34 -0500, "C. E. White"
<cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:

>Given Toyota's notoriously bad Customer Service

Ed Ed Ed.......

I could see any company giving you bad service.

You are sooooooooooooooooooooo Negative...

I've had GREAT service from Toyota.

That includes my Sister, Brother and Son.....all Toyota drivers.

Put on a good attitude and the whole world seems to get better.

Try it....

--
Scott in Florida

"Scott in Florida" <JustAskl@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:1m6gl3d0submvs26te4s4jup4ltf4mqt8r@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 07:55:34 -0500, "C. E. White"
> <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>Given Toyota's notoriously bad Customer Service
>
> Ed Ed Ed.......
>
> I could see any company giving you bad service.
>
> You are sooooooooooooooooooooo Negative...
>
> I've had GREAT service from Toyota.
>
> That includes my Sister, Brother and Son.....all Toyota drivers.
>
> Put on a good attitude and the whole world seems to get better.

I almost think you are a Toyota plant. Even CR acknowledges Toyota has
poor Customer Service. It is hard to smile when they screw you at
every turn. My SO had to go to a dealer 50 miles away to get a fair
price on Her RAV4. The local dealers act like they are doing you a
favor to sell you a car at list price (and they still try to tack on
outrageous "doc" fees). I've bought a lot of new cars in my life, and
Toyota dealers have consistently been the worst to deal with. The
parts and service people have been friendly enough, right up until you
have to pay the bill. My older Sister had such a bad experience with a
Toyota dealer, she empathically told me HELL NO when I suggested she
might like to at least test drive a RAV4 like my SO has. I guess it is
good for Toyota that they have a few good dealers - I guess you just
have to look for them. The dealer my SO used was friendly enough.
While she was doing the paperwork on the RAV4 I chatted with a
salesman about Toyotas. I wish I had priced them when I was looking
for a new truck. If I had, I might have gone with a Tacoma instead of
a Frontier. The difference between the local Toyota and Nissan dealers
was night and day. I visited the three closest Toyota dealers and the
salesmen were arrogant pricks. The Nissan salesman bent over backwards
to satisfy me. When he found out who I worked for, he even let me know
that I was eligible for "supplier pricing" which saved me a few
hundred more dollars. A far as I could tell the local Toyota dealers
only considered me eligible for "Screw You" pricing. OK, I feel;
better now. Every time I have to remember my personal dealings with
the local Toyota dealers I go a little crazy. But 20+ years of bad
experiences are hard to overcome.

Ed

"C. E. White" <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:47582408$1@kcnews01...
>
> "Scott in Florida" <JustAskl@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:1m6gl3d0submvs26te4s4jup4ltf4mqt8r@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 07:55:34 -0500, "C. E. White"
>> <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Given Toyota's notoriously bad Customer Service
>>
>> Ed Ed Ed.......
>>
>> I could see any company giving you bad service.
>>
>> You are sooooooooooooooooooooo Negative...
>>
>> I've had GREAT service from Toyota.
>>
>> That includes my Sister, Brother and Son.....all Toyota drivers.
>>
>> Put on a good attitude and the whole world seems to get better.
>
> I almost think you are a Toyota plant. Even CR acknowledges Toyota has
> poor Customer Service. It is hard to smile when they screw you at every
> turn. My SO had to go to a dealer 50 miles away to get a fair price on Her
> RAV4. The local dealers act like they are doing you a favor to sell you a
> car at list price (and they still try to tack on outrageous "doc" fees).
> I've bought a lot of new cars in my life, and Toyota dealers have
> consistently been the worst to deal with. The parts and service people
> have been friendly enough, right up until you have to pay the bill. My
> older Sister had such a bad experience with a Toyota dealer, she
> empathically told me HELL NO when I suggested she might like to at least
> test drive a RAV4 like my SO has. I guess it is good for Toyota that they
> have a few good dealers - I guess you just have to look for them. The
> dealer my SO used was friendly enough. While she was doing the paperwork
> on the RAV4 I chatted with a salesman about Toyotas. I wish I had priced
> them when I was looking for a new truck. If I had, I might have gone with
> a Tacoma instead of a Frontier. The difference between the local Toyota
> and Nissan dealers was night and day. I visited the three closest Toyota
> dealers and the salesmen were arrogant pricks. The Nissan salesman bent
> over backwards to satisfy me. When he found out who I worked for, he even
> let me know that I was eligible for "supplier pricing" which saved me a
> few hundred more dollars. A far as I could tell the local Toyota dealers
> only considered me eligible for "Screw You" pricing. OK, I feel; better
> now. Every time I have to remember my personal dealings with the local
> Toyota dealers I go a little crazy. But 20+ years of bad experiences are
> hard to overcome.
>
> Ed

Your SO chooses to stay with you. First example of her bad judgment. The
list goes on....


>
>

On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 11:29:57 -0500, "C. E. White"
<cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:

>
>"Scott in Florida" <JustAskl@verizon.net> wrote in message
>news:1m6gl3d0submvs26te4s4jup4ltf4mqt8r@4ax.com.. .
>> On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 07:55:34 -0500, "C. E. White"
>> <cewhite3@removemindspring.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Given Toyota's notoriously bad Customer Service
>>
>> Ed Ed Ed.......
>>
>> I could see any company giving you bad service.
>>
>> You are sooooooooooooooooooooo Negative...
>>
>> I've had GREAT service from Toyota.
>>
>> That includes my Sister, Brother and Son.....all Toyota drivers.
>>
>> Put on a good attitude and the whole world seems to get better.
>
>I almost think you are a Toyota plant. Even CR acknowledges Toyota has
>poor Customer Service.

Well you and they are wrong.

I have bought two Toys from the local dealer. They were pleasant.

When it came time for my son to buy a new Toy, we would NOT pay the
exorbitant 700 bucks the local SE Toyota dealers tag on.

We ended up buying in Philadelphia.

He and I flew to Philadelphia. The dealer there picked us up at the airport
and we were out of there in an hour.

Very pleasant.

Faulkner Toyota.

I'd buy from them again.

You only deal with the sales people once in the life of your Toy.

The rest is the service department.

My area has two great service departments.

Today was a good example.

I made an appointment to get the first ! 4 wheel alignment in 215,000 miles
and an oil change.

When I pulled in the service manager walked up and shook my hand and asked
what I was in for. He had his top writer take care of me. I'm sure my car
went in before a LOT of others.

That is because I am very pleasant and establish relationships with people I
do business with. I suggest you take the chip off your shoulder and try the
same!

While in the dealership, I purchased an air filter....and asked for a 'good
customer discount'...the parts guy looked me up and gave it to me.

If your attitude on here is an indication of how you deal with people in
daily life, I'm not surprised at the stories you come in here with...



>
> It is hard to smile when they screw you at
>every turn. My SO had to go to a dealer 50 miles away to get a fair
>price on Her RAV4. The local dealers act like they are doing you a
>favor to sell you a car at list price (and they still try to tack on
>outrageous "doc" fees). I've bought a lot of new cars in my life, and
>Toyota dealers have consistently been the worst to deal with. The
>parts and service people have been friendly enough, right up until you
>have to pay the bill. My older Sister had such a bad experience with a
>Toyota dealer, she empathically told me HELL NO when I suggested she
>might like to at least test drive a RAV4 like my SO has. I guess it is
>good for Toyota that they have a few good dealers - I guess you just
>have to look for them. The dealer my SO used was friendly enough.
>While she was doing the paperwork on the RAV4 I chatted with a
>salesman about Toyotas. I wish I had priced them when I was looking
>for a new truck. If I had, I might have gone with a Tacoma instead of
>a Frontier. The difference between the local Toyota and Nissan dealers
>was night and day. I visited the three closest Toyota dealers and the
>salesmen were arrogant pricks. The Nissan salesman bent over backwards
>to satisfy me. When he found out who I worked for, he even let me know
>that I was eligible for "supplier pricing" which saved me a few
>hundred more dollars. A far as I could tell the local Toyota dealers
>only considered me eligible for "Screw You" pricing. OK, I feel;
>better now. Every time I have to remember my personal dealings with
>the local Toyota dealers I go a little crazy. But 20+ years of bad
>experiences are hard to overcome.
>
>Ed
>
--
Scott in Florida

Scott in Florida wrote:

> I have bought two Toys from the local dealer. They were pleasant.
========

What Toyotas are they? I think the only ones we know about are
your Corolla wagon? That's the one with 215,000 miles, right?

I think it depends on the expected life of the car. If Toyota starts
sending out coupons after 4 years then no ATF change during that
period would be fine. But given some of these U-series transmissions
started skipping gears right out of the factory, I'm not sure the no-
maintenance claim is a good one. For one, in 2004 Toyota lowered the
"normal" oil change interval from 7500 miles down to 5000 miles.



On Dec 6, 4:55 am, "C. E. White" <cewhi...@removemindspring.com>
wrote:
> This might be news for Toyotas, but it isn't different from millions
> of other vehicles. My Father never had the automatic transmission
> fluid changed in anything he owned, and never had a transmission fail
> either except for one. I managed to kill a C4 in an old
> Fairlane....this may have had something to do with running the car
> into a pond (don't tell Dad) .......
>
> The problem I see here is the wording......"under normal conditions."
> Given Toyota's notoriously bad Customer Service, what are the chances
> that they will blame you if your transmission prematurely fails down
> the road and you can't produce notarized, signed in blood receipts
> from a Toyota Dealer in Japan proving you had the transmission fluid
> changed every 30K miles......
>
> I am planning on draining the fluid from the transmission pan of my
> SO's RAV4 every 30K miles and adding that much fresh fluid. I know
> that won't change the fluid in the torque converter, but I figure
> renewing part of the fluid regularly will be a good thing. I'll buy
> the fluid at the Toyota dealer. Hopefully I can use those receipt to
> fight off the Toyota Goons if the transmission fails prematurely.
>
> Ed

Built_Well wrote:
>
> Scott in Florida wrote:
>
>> I have bought two Toys from the local dealer. They were pleasant.
> ========
>
> What Toyotas are they? I think the only ones we know about are
> your Corolla wagon? That's the one with 215,000 miles, right?
========


Your Corolla wagon certainly has been a trusty, stable car. Nobody
can say it's "unstable" :-)

"Scott in Florida" <JustAskl@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:cd2hl3pd4mn709mrn3qsm2cebu1a5arbtr@4ax.com...

>>I almost think you are a Toyota plant. Even CR acknowledges Toyota has
>>poor Customer Service.
>
> Well you and they are wrong.

Your experience is not more improtant than mine. The local Toyota dealers,
in my opinion, provide horrible Customer service. I am glad you have had
good experiences. However, JD Powers has surveyed many people, and on
average Toyta Customer Serivce rates poorly (well below average).
http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/new...spx?ID=2007270
http://www.jdpower.com/corporate/new...spx?ID=2007112

> I have bought two Toys from the local dealer. They were pleasant.

I didn't say all dealers were bad, just all the local ones where I live. The
dealer my SO bought her RAV4 from was pleasant enough, but it is 50 miles
away.

> When it came time for my son to buy a new Toy, we would NOT pay the
> exorbitant 700 bucks the local SE Toyota dealers tag on.
>
> We ended up buying in Philadelphia.
>
> He and I flew to Philadelphia. The dealer there picked us up at the
> airport
> and we were out of there in an hour.

You had to fly from Florida to Philidelphia to buy a Toyota at a fair price
and you are climing Toyota has good Customer Serive? No wonder we disagree.
Apparently you don't mind being screwed by Toyota.

> Very pleasant.
>
> Faulkner Toyota.
>
> I'd buy from them again.
>
> You only deal with the sales people once in the life of your Toy.
>
> The rest is the service department.
>
> My area has two great service departments.

Good for you. I rarely deal with service departments. I think I've had to
take my Fords back to the Ford service department a total of 4 times in the
last 12 years. My Nissan has been back more frequently (three times so far
in 2 years, but all under warranty). I've tried to deal with the local
Toyota sales people more than that when shopping for vehicles.

> Today was a good example.
>
> I made an appointment to get the first ! 4 wheel alignment in 215,000
> miles
> and an oil change.
>
> When I pulled in the service manager walked up and shook my hand and asked
> what I was in for. He had his top writer take care of me. I'm sure my
> car
> went in before a LOT of others.
>
> That is because I am very pleasant and establish relationships with people
> I
> do business with. I suggest you take the chip off your shoulder and try
> the
> same!

I get along very well with the sales people at the local dealers, even
Toyota sales people. I don't blame the actual sales people for the poor
service. They probably want to sell me a car more than I want to buy it. The
local dealers spend big bucks on TV ads claiming low prices, but the reality
is far different. The sales people don't set the prices, the management
does. And the management tries to stack on ridiculous doc fees. I find the
sales practices of the local Toyota dealers particularly distasteful. If
this means I have a chip on my shoulder, then so be it. How am I different
from you? You flew a thousand miles because you didn't like a local Toyota
dealer. I dislike the idea of going 50 miles to find a decent dealer.

> While in the dealership, I purchased an air filter....and asked for a
> 'good
> customer discount'...the parts guy looked me up and gave it to me.

I get the good Customer discount at the local Ford and Nissan dealers - not
that I do much buisness with them lately. I usually buy my air and
transmission filters (and Nissan oil filters) from them, but that is about
the only things I have needed for a long time.

> If your attitude on here is an indication of how you deal with people in
> daily life, I'm not surprised at the stories you come in here with...

Exactly what is my attitude? Why do you assume I have a bad attitude just
because I don't praise Toyotas? Should I enjoy being screwed by Toyota?

Ed

On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 10:27:21 -0500, "C. E. White" <cewhite3@mindspring.com>
wrote:

>You had to fly from Florida to Philidelphia to buy a Toyota at a fair price
>and you are climing Toyota has good Customer Serive?

Absolutely!

I personally will NOT pay 700 bucks that SouthEast Toyota puts on EVERY new
Toy.

Plane tickets are cheap.

Great experience.

plus I had a road trip with my son. That is a treat!

--
Scott in Florida