On 7/23/08 10:46 AM, in article
b3596bce-7a72-4a44-aa19-3516ca9d1747...oglegroups.com, "N8N"
<njnagel@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Jul 23, 11:38*am, Built_Well <Built_Well_Toy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> I was surprised to read that the 2 bottom trim levels of the
>>
>> new Passat do not come with automatic headlights. *You have
>>
>> to spring for the third trim level (called Lux) to get the
>> automatics. *Kinda surprised me. *All trims are turbo, though,
>> even the bottom trim. *The little 4-cylinder (just 2.0 liter)
>> engine can put out 200 horsepower.
>>
>> The Jetta, assembled in Mexico, now comes with a 5th cylinder.
>> It's an inline 5, and boasts 2.5 liters, more than my 2.4 liter
>> Camry. *But Consumer Reports says Volkswagen isn't known for
>> its long-term reliability. *A Consumer Reports survey of owners
>> listed the '06 Passat as one of the least reliable family cars,
>> but it drives really good, nice handling.
>
> IMHO CR is full of crap WRT VW. Probably they just don't take a long
> term enough view. I wish I hadn't sold my '84 Scirocco; that was the
> most reliabile, bulletproof car I've ever owned. The problem with VWs
> is they do tend to have teething problems when new, which reflects
> badly on surveys, but they will run for literally decades with only
> regular maintenance.
>
> That said, I would steer clear of the B-chassis models (Passat) and
> stick with the A-chassis (Rabbit, Jetta, Scirocco, Golf) as the Passat
> is known for finicky electrics.
>
> Of course, if the nicer trim and better driving qualities of the VW
> aren't important to you, it is also hard to go wrong with Toyota. I'm
> a die hard VW fan, but even so, I have to give some grudging respect
> to Toyota for continuously churning out reliable, durable vehicles as
> well.
>
> The VW 20V turbo 4-cylinders (1.8T and now 2.0T) are just ludicrous.
> If you think you want to stick with Toyota you should probably never
> drive one. The torque is intoxicating. I would love to get a pre-82
> Scirocco (or maybe a Corrado G60, or a Porsche 924) and drop a 1.8T or
> 2.0T in it, that would just be a stupidly quick combination.
>
> nate

My experience with VW says CR is dead on. My '79 Rabbit was beyond all
doubt the worst car I ever owned. The engine compartment ground bundle
located directly beneath the drip spout under the battery epitomized the
stupid engineering that went into that car.

On Jul 23, 2:34*pm, E Meyer <epmeye...@msn.com> wrote:
> On 7/23/08 10:46 AM, in article
> b3596bce-7a72-4a44-aa19-3516ca9d1...@p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com, "N8N"
>
>
>
>
>
> <njna...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jul 23, 11:38*am, Built_Well <Built_Well_Toy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> I was surprised to read that the 2 bottom trim levels of the
>
> >> new Passat do not come with automatic headlights. *You have
>
> >> to spring for the third trim level (called Lux) to get the
> >> automatics. *Kinda surprised me. *All trims are turbo, though,
> >> even the bottom trim. *The little 4-cylinder (just 2.0 liter)
> >> engine can put out 200 horsepower.
>
> >> The Jetta, assembled in Mexico, now comes with a 5th cylinder.
> >> It's an inline 5, and boasts 2.5 liters, more than my 2.4 liter
> >> Camry. *But Consumer Reports says Volkswagen isn't known for
> >> its long-term reliability. *A Consumer Reports survey of owners
> >> listed the '06 Passat as one of the least reliable family cars,
> >> but it drives really good, nice handling.
>
> > IMHO CR is full of crap WRT VW. *Probably they just don't take a long
> > term enough view. *I wish I hadn't sold my '84 Scirocco; that was the
> > most reliabile, bulletproof car I've ever owned. *The problem with VWs
> > is they do tend to have teething problems when new, which reflects
> > badly on surveys, but they will run for literally decades with only
> > regular maintenance.
>
> > That said, I would steer clear of the B-chassis models (Passat) and
> > stick with the A-chassis (Rabbit, Jetta, Scirocco, Golf) as the Passat
> > is known for finicky electrics.
>
> > Of course, if the nicer trim and better driving qualities of the VW
> > aren't important to you, it is also hard to go wrong with Toyota. *I'm
> > a die hard VW fan, but even so, I have to give some grudging respect
> > to Toyota for continuously churning out reliable, durable vehicles as
> > well.
>
> > The VW 20V turbo 4-cylinders (1.8T and now 2.0T) are just ludicrous.
> > If you think you want to stick with Toyota you should probably never
> > drive one. *The torque is intoxicating. *I would love to get a pre-82
> > Scirocco (or maybe a Corrado G60, or a Porsche 924) and drop a 1.8T or
> > 2.0T in it, that would just be a stupidly quick combination.
>
> > nate
>
> My experience with VW says CR is dead on. *My '79 Rabbit was beyond all
> doubt the worst car I ever owned. *The engine compartment ground bundle
> located directly beneath the drip spout under the battery epitomized the
> stupid engineering that went into that car.

I've had quite a few 80's era watercooled VWs over the years and I can
honestly say that only two were in any way finicky - my '89 GTI 16V,
because it was a resurrected "barn car" (once I replaced pretty much
any accessory with bearings, it was quite reliable - I eventually sold
it to a friend who drove it daily until a year or two ago when she
sold it) and SWMBO's '90 Corrado G60, because it's a Corrado and those
aren't up to normal VW standards.

My cars were not pampered - sat outside 24/7, expected to start on a
moment's notice after sitting for a week or more, be able to drive up
and down the east coast without any preparation, etc. and they never
let me down.

nate

"N8N" <njnagel@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cdf788cd-24bd-4ca3-8ae8-510dd160f946@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
On Jul 23, 2:34 pm, E Meyer <epmeye...@msn.com> wrote:
> On 7/23/08 10:46 AM, in article
> b3596bce-7a72-4a44-aa19-3516ca9d1...@p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com, "N8N"

I've had quite a few 80's era watercooled VWs over the years and I can
honestly say that only two were in any way finicky - my '89 GTI 16V,
because it was a resurrected "barn car" (once I replaced pretty much
any accessory with bearings, it was quite reliable - I eventually sold
it to a friend who drove it daily until a year or two ago when she
sold it) and SWMBO's '90 Corrado G60, because it's a Corrado and those
aren't up to normal VW standards.

My cars were not pampered - sat outside 24/7, expected to start on a
moment's notice after sitting for a week or more, be able to drive up
and down the east coast without any preparation, etc. and they never
let me down.


====


I had two VW Golfs (1.8 petrol - a 1988 Mark II and a 1993 Mark III). I was
generally very pleased with them, though they were fairly expensive to
maintain because of the high cost of parts, even in the UK which is not as
far from Germany as, for example, the USA is.

The first car (which had a carburettor) had a problem with its automatic
choke which occasionally in hot weather made the engine race - very
embarrassingly once when I got stuck in a traffic jam on the infamous M25
motorway ("London's orbital car-park"!) and I had to turn off the engine
every time I came to a stand-still and then slip the clutch like mad to
crawl forward a few feet. But that was fixed fairly quickly and under
warranty.

The second one developed an annoying problem where the engine kept losing
power or hesitating. It kept going back to the garage and they could never
find anything. Eventually they decided to keep it for a week and loan me
another car in the meantime so they could give it a good test. On the last
day the mechanic rang up in a state of considerable elation and yelled "It's
just gone wrong! I know what it is! I've fixed it!" - it was the throttle
sensor which detects the position of the throttle pedal and feeds the info
to the engine management unit: this had developed a fault. The component
cost a few quid but the labour was going to be several hundred pounds...
until I was able to produce a garage receipt showing that the car was still
within the mileage limit for the warranty when I first reported the fault,
so VW head office eventually agreed to pay up.

The first car was lovely - much more lively than the other one though the
power and torque were very similar. Only slight design flaw: the sill at the
base of the windscreen had tiny drain holes into the wheel arches and these
easily got blocked. Once day after torrential rain overnight I got into the
car and found I was paddling in six inches of water! Having got the majority
of the water out with buckets and mopped up with towels, I then spent one
weekend removing the seats and then the carpet so I could wash the carpets
(which had started to smell - especially the underlay). It was weird driving
around with bare metal floor and only my seat ;-)

Fuel economy was not brilliant - about 30-35 mpg (UK) which is about 24-28
mpg (US).

I now have a Peugeot 306 diesel which has just done 129,000 miles and is
still going strong after nine years. 50-55 mpg, bullet-proof, starts first
time every time whatever the weather. But it's getting to the age when
expensive things are starting to need attention: new catalytic converter,
replacement cambelt (scheduled), two new fanbelts (unplanned - second one
was because garage that fitted first one didn't notice that a pulley was
wobbly so it took out the belt after about a month - GRRRRR!).

I'm not sure what I'd replace it with because I don't like the Peugeot 307
or 308, and the VW Golf is very expensive for what it is and, like so many
modern cars, has one of these not-fit-for-purpose spacesaver spare wheels.
Also the rear seats don't remove so I wouldn't be able to carry my bicycle
as easily. The Honda Civic (new shape) and the Citroen C4 are gimmicky
(digital instruments in the centre of the dashboard).

Ford and Vauxhall - boring!

Ve hav ways of getting to dose dat talk da ve you do. Wis a nomin lik
Meyer, yo shud be carful if yo still hav relatives living in za Fadderland
LOL



"E Meyer" <epmeyer50@msn.com> wrote in message
news:C4ACE3F9.32D70%epmeyer50@msn.com...
>
> My experience with VW says CR is dead on. My '79 Rabbit was beyond all
> doubt the worst car I ever owned. The engine compartment ground bundle
> located directly beneath the drip spout under the battery epitomized the
> stupid engineering that went into that car.
>

"Mortimer" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:zOqdnTjDGKy8GhrVnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@posted.plusn et...
> "N8N" <njnagel@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:cdf788cd-24bd-4ca3-8ae8-510dd160f946@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
> On Jul 23, 2:34 pm, E Meyer <epmeye...@msn.com> wrote:
>> On 7/23/08 10:46 AM, in article
>> b3596bce-7a72-4a44-aa19-3516ca9d1...@p25g2000hsf.googlegroups.com, "N8N"
>
> I've had quite a few 80's era watercooled VWs over the years and I can
> honestly say that only two were in any way finicky - my '89 GTI 16V,
> because it was a resurrected "barn car" (once I replaced pretty much
> any accessory with bearings, it was quite reliable - I eventually sold
> it to a friend who drove it daily until a year or two ago when she
> sold it) and SWMBO's '90 Corrado G60, because it's a Corrado and those
> aren't up to normal VW standards.
>
> My cars were not pampered - sat outside 24/7, expected to start on a
> moment's notice after sitting for a week or more, be able to drive up
> and down the east coast without any preparation, etc. and they never
> let me down.
>
>
> ====
>
>
> I had two VW Golfs (1.8 petrol - a 1988 Mark II and a 1993 Mark III). I
> was generally very pleased with them, though they were fairly expensive to
> maintain because of the high cost of parts, even in the UK which is not as
> far from Germany as, for example, the USA is.
>
> The first car (which had a carburettor) had a problem with its automatic
> choke which occasionally in hot weather made the engine race - very
> embarrassingly once when I got stuck in a traffic jam on the infamous M25
> motorway ("London's orbital car-park"!) and I had to turn off the engine
> every time I came to a stand-still and then slip the clutch like mad to
> crawl forward a few feet. But that was fixed fairly quickly and under
> warranty.
>
> The second one developed an annoying problem where the engine kept losing
> power or hesitating. It kept going back to the garage and they could never
> find anything. Eventually they decided to keep it for a week and loan me
> another car in the meantime so they could give it a good test. On the last
> day the mechanic rang up in a state of considerable elation and yelled
> "It's just gone wrong! I know what it is! I've fixed it!" - it was the
> throttle sensor which detects the position of the throttle pedal and feeds
> the info to the engine management unit: this had developed a fault. The
> component cost a few quid but the labour was going to be several hundred
> pounds... until I was able to produce a garage receipt showing that the
> car was still within the mileage limit for the warranty when I first
> reported the fault, so VW head office eventually agreed to pay up.
>
> The first car was lovely - much more lively than the other one though the
> power and torque were very similar. Only slight design flaw: the sill at
> the base of the windscreen had tiny drain holes into the wheel arches and
> these easily got blocked. Once day after torrential rain overnight I got
> into the car and found I was paddling in six inches of water! Having got
> the majority of the water out with buckets and mopped up with towels, I
> then spent one weekend removing the seats and then the carpet so I could
> wash the carpets (which had started to smell - especially the underlay).
> It was weird driving around with bare metal floor and only my seat ;-)
>
> Fuel economy was not brilliant - about 30-35 mpg (UK) which is about 24-28
> mpg (US).
>
> I now have a Peugeot 306 diesel which has just done 129,000 miles and is
> still going strong after nine years. 50-55 mpg, bullet-proof, starts first
> time every time whatever the weather. But it's getting to the age when
> expensive things are starting to need attention: new catalytic converter,
> replacement cambelt (scheduled), two new fanbelts (unplanned - second one
> was because garage that fitted first one didn't notice that a pulley was
> wobbly so it took out the belt after about a month - GRRRRR!).
>
> I'm not sure what I'd replace it with because I don't like the Peugeot 307
> or 308, and the VW Golf is very expensive for what it is and, like so many
> modern cars, has one of these not-fit-for-purpose spacesaver spare wheels.
> Also the rear seats don't remove so I wouldn't be able to carry my bicycle
> as easily. The Honda Civic (new shape) and the Citroen C4 are gimmicky
> (digital instruments in the centre of the dashboard).
>
> Ford and Vauxhall - boring!
>



And Peugeot in the US... cannot be had. Too bad as they seem to perform
beautifully now days, but crashed and burned when they were in the states.

Willy

"Willy" <wesk@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:SyQhk.31020$co7.19059@nlpi066.nbdc.sbc.com...
> And Peugeot in the US... cannot be had. Too bad as they seem to perform
> beautifully now days, but crashed and burned when they were in the states.

It's strange which cars are and aren't sold in a given country. It's only
very recently (maybe the last five or ten years) that American cars such as
Cadillac have been sold in the UK.