In article <cvzBh.3066$tD2.710@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.n et>
rlanni@access4less.net "R PRINCETON" writes:

> Unbelievable! 11 answers and counting and no-one answers my original
> question! Are you all a bunch of politicians!?!?!?!
>
> OK, enough ranting....
>
> Ignoring, increased wear and tear on the batteries or engine, total energy
> equations involving my old coal powered power plant; and any disturbances in
> subspace temporal harmonics....
>
> DID THE EV only switch increase peoples mileage? and by how much?

Did you actually READ all the responses, to your questions and
the others you no doubt found when you no doubt Googled on the
recent traffic in this NG, and THINK about them?

The implication was that it's not worth doing. The car is set
to care for itself and the battery. "Mileage" is another word
for "efficiency" in this context. Greater efficiency turns on
making better overall use of the fuel put into the tank. Read
my past posts on my EV experiments (see recent Google). EV is
purely there to solve local problems unrelated to efficiency.

GOT IT? Thank you. That ends this party political broadcast.
--
Andrew Stephenson

In article <lEJBh.3207$tD2.1013@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink. net>
rlanni@access4less.net "R PRINCETON" writes:

> [...]

I'm tempted to throw this out to anyone else in the Toyota NG who
isn't thoroughly fed up with explaining the same notions over and
over. But try this (with my own questions):

> "ICV"

Don't know that term. "Internal Combustion [something]"? If you
mean the petrol [US:gas] engine, you cannot rely on how often the
mimic diagram shows it running, as a guide to relative energy o/p
of it vs the electric generator/battery/motor side of things.

Please read this bit carefully and try to accept it: the Prius is
set up to manage its own internal systems. The "EV" button seems
to have been a marketing experiment, nothing more. As far as the
NG can tell, it is fitted to EU/UK models and not to US ones. My
experimental results, which you should have found if you Googled,
show its range is functionally pathetic on the open road; it only
serves any purpose where you want to discourage (NB, not prevent)
the engine from firing up. It has no overall impact on the miles
you get out of each gallon (except in a very marginal way, due to
interference with the car's control system). It will not help in
passing Go, nor will it collect for you $200.

The petrol engine and electric motor run separately, or together,
according to whatever the car's control system thinks appropriate
so don't try to mess with it. If you don't like this arrangement
then lift the bonnet [US:hood] and put an axe through that large,
shiny box above the electric motor/generator/planetarygear lump.

> BTW; I am a Physicist by training. I am not interested in
> "Implications" I want facts!

Then you are unusual. All the Physicists (and physicists) I have
ever known have also been interested in the implications of data,
especially those which _appear_ to be anomalous.

> -thank you

You're welcome. If nobody objects, I'm going off duty now.
--
Andrew Stephenson

On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 20:33:21 +0000, R PRINCETON wrote:

> I have noticed that the ICV in my Prius runs way more often than I
> expected, and for more than just recharging the batteries. The cute
> animation in the LCD display clearly shows that most of the time the ICV
> is powering the wheels, i.e., providing more power than the electric motor
> by itself can provide. I am suspicious that this is done so as to
> improve the Prius's "drivability" in the US; i.e., greater acceleration.
> Us Americans are accustomed to "tearing" away from the traffic light.


This is exactly it. They use the Gas engine more in the US to provide the
performance Americans expect.

The funny thing is, the average American Prius driver drives the damn car
like a silver-haired Granny in the 1964 F-85 she bought brand new 43 years
ago. So adding the EV mode would be a good idea on Toyota's part. In the
week I drove one, I spent some time crawling from a start, and found it
did NOTHING! I was getting better mileage with an AT Tercel. When I
started driving it 'normal', the numbers didn't budge.

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 09:53:52 -0800, mrv@kluge.net wrote:

>> The funny thing is, the average American Prius driver drives the damn
>> car like a silver-haired Granny in the 1964 F-85 she bought brand new 43
>> years ago. So adding the EV mode would be a good idea on Toyota's part.
>> In the week I drove one, I spent some time crawling from a start, and
>> found it did NOTHING! I was getting better mileage with an AT Tercel.
>> When I started driving it 'normal', the numbers didn't budge.
>
> Yes, and you've already said that that was on a pre-production model in
> 2000. The car has had numerous changes since then! I suggest that you
> try another week test drive in a current NHW20 Prius.
>
> (There's also far better emissions controls (notorious for lowering fuel
> economy) since your AT Tercel... and I won't get into the apples and
> oranges of comparing a manual to an automatic CVT...)


It was an AT Tercel...

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 06:38:24 -0500, mark_digital© wrote:

>
> "Hachiroku ????" <Trueno@AE86.gts> wrote in message
> news:XDRBh.5880$am1.2065@trndny01...
>> On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 20:33:21 +0000, R PRINCETON wrote:
>>
>>> I have noticed that the ICV in my Prius runs way more often than I
>>> expected, and for more than just recharging the batteries. The cute
>>> animation in the LCD display clearly shows that most of the time the
>>> ICV is powering the wheels, i.e., providing more power than the
>>> electric motor
>>> by itself can provide. I am suspicious that this is done so as to
>>> improve the Prius's "drivability" in the US; i.e., greater
>>> acceleration. Us Americans are accustomed to "tearing" away from the
>>> traffic light.
>>
>>
>> This is exactly it. They use the Gas engine more in the US to provide
>> the performance Americans expect.
>>
>> The funny thing is, the average American Prius driver drives the damn
>> car like a silver-haired Granny in the 1964 F-85 she bought brand new 43
>> years ago. So adding the EV mode would be a good idea on Toyota's part.
>> In the week I drove one, I spent some time crawling from a start, and
>> found it did NOTHING! I was getting better mileage with an AT Tercel.
>> When I started driving it 'normal', the numbers didn't budge.
>>
>>
> If the traction battery has the charged potential to move the car 1000 ft
> it doesn't matter if it's at acceleration from a dead stop or dispersed
> for the next couple of miles.
> So, I agree with your experience 100%. I disagree with your one week
> assessment of mpg though, unless you filled the tank several times during
> that week.


I was reading it off the computer...

On Sun, 18 Feb 2007 07:59:03 -0500, mark_digital© wrote:

> BTW, I'll be at Thorn's market today sometime around 1 pm. I'm easy to
> spot. I won't be wearing a winter coat


Whew...I was...it was colder today!

In article <VDjCh.4004$tD2.98@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.ne t>
rlanni@access4less.net "R PRINCETON" writes:

> Clearly no one has installed an EV button, and utililized it in
> a consistent fashion (for example turning it on when you
> anticipate driving for less than 2 miles) and measured the
> resulting mileage.

Forgive my bluntness, Mister Physicist, but it seems called for.
Either you've not actually been paying attention to what we have
been posting, or you're an idiot, or some mixture of both. Data
to hand indicate the third condition, plus ignorance and ego.

When are you going to catch on that the Prius "EV" mode does not
allow one to use it as you describe? Yes, you could engage "EV"
for (say) a series of very short trips. But sooner or later the
car's control system would decide the big battery had discharged
deeply enough to warrant flipping out of "EV" mode and firing up
the petrol engine for a recharge. It does that whether you like
it or not, to safeguard the battery (not to mention your ability
to drive the car). The length of run just isn't worth it for an
average user, the person for whom Toyota make this car. IOW, as
you've been told, repeatedly: THE CAR IS IN CHARGE OF STUFF LIKE
THAT -- NOT YOU.

If you don't like that you already know one solution. The other
is: shun this current Prius generation entirely -- along with us
farts here shooting the breeze. I especially like the last bit.

(Trolls. Bah. You just can't get classy/clever ones any more.)
--
Andrew Stephenson